Tulsi: Trump: Stop hiding Saudi role in 911 and protecting Al Qaeda
and? Do you really think this is a win for the Kurds - or do concede that they're going with Assad because there may be fewer deaths with him then with going against Turkey?
Are you trying to prove that Russia and Assad are the heroes in this scenario?
jamie said:
and? Do you really think this is a win for the Kurds - or do concede that they're going with Assad because there may be fewer deaths with him then with going against Turkey?
Are you trying to prove that Russia and Assad are the heroes in this scenario?
In the immediate situation, I wouldn't call them "heroes" but I would call them "protectors" What they are in the long-term depends on the degree to which each side is willing to compromise.
But for the Kurds, the dream of a unified state across Iran, Syria, Iraq and Turkey is off the table.
Edited to Add: Erdogan's visit to Moscow on Tuesday will have a major impact on where this goes.
We had a cheap, small deployment of troops who were keeping mayhem from happening the same way we do between North and South Korea. Now we have to hope things don't spiral into something where we need a much larger deployment at a later date at a significantly higher expense. Brilliant military strategy.
Meanwhile our international promises are now interpreted as having a four year expiration date.
Nice to see Tulsi continue to make her case for a nighttime show on Fox.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/tulsi-gabbard-2020-democrat-candidates-hillary-clinton
sbenois said:
Nice to see Tulsi continue to make her case for a nighttime show on Fox.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/tulsi-gabbard-2020-democrat-candidates-hillary-clinton
Lots of people going on Fox
Here's a 10-tweet thread by Syrian expert Oklahoma University prof. Joshua Landis on the arrogance and harm caused by US regime-change efforts in Syria:
https://twitter.com/joshua_landis/status/1187403558804692999
1. The US mistake in Lebanon was not Reagan's refusal to remain & fight Hezbollah after 1983, but to team buy into the Israeli invasion of Lebanon in 1982. Israel's ambition to destroy the PLO & return Lebanon to Maronite rule was not something the US should have signed onto.
2. The US's mistake in Syria was to arm the Syrian militias. The US could not adjudicate the Syrian civil war any more than it could Lebanon's. 8 years later, the result is failure and a Syria that is much more damaged than it would have been had the US stayed out.
3. Trump was correct not to promise the Kurds a quasi-state. Staying in Syria for the "long-haul," as Special Envoy James Jeffrey intended, was a fool's errand. The US cannot hope to expel Iran from Syria, just as It cannot deliver on an independent entity for Syria's Kurds.
Syria's Kurds number only 2 million. NE Syria is the most under-developed region of Syria. The US notion of building it into a separate state is crazy. Most importantly, the Kurds do not have an air force; they will be overwhelmed as soon as the US withdraws. The Kurds need Damascus.
4. The US's effort, along with that of TR, KSA, Qatar, et. al., to arm the Syrian militias led to the empowerment of al-Qaida & ISIS, just as the US occupation of Iraq did - just as Israel's occupation of Lebanon led to the emergence of Hezbollah.
5. Yes, the Assad regime misruled Syria, is narrow, corrupt and depends on a minoritarian strategy, but arming the Sunni insurgency led to sectarian extremism & intern'l escalation, just as Israel's arming of Al-Kata'ib led to sectarian extremism & intern'l escalation in Lebanon.
6. Neither Israel's strategy of destroying the PLO in Lebanon, nor the US's strategy of destroying the Assad regime in Syria were winning strategies. They made bad situations worse, fueled instability & extremism.
7. ISIS does not have to "return" in Syria. The only viable long-term solution to ensuring the defeat of ISIS in Syria is to assist the return of central authority to the region. As Amb. Crocker said: “Extremists groups move into ungoverned spaces.”
8. Russia, the YPG, and Damascus are trying to restore a return of government in N.E. Syria in the wake of the US pull out. All are enemies of ISIS. It is incumbent on the US, now that it has withdrawn, to support their coordination & anti-ISIS efforts.
9. Iran and Russia are rivals of the US, but any effort by Washington to undermine their efforts to bring stability to NE Syria will only help ISIS & extremist groups. If the US keeps troops in the area, takes oil wells, or resists the transition of authority, it will serve ISIS.
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
paulsurovell said:
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
Number 10 is the sociopath's way of summarizing the issue.
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
Number 10 is the sociopath's way of summarizing the issue.
I guess that's logical from a Neocon, regime-change perspective.
paulsurovell said:
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
Number 10 is the sociopath's way of summarizing the issue.
I guess that's logical from a Neocon, regime-change perspective.
No, it's logical from the "reading the plain language that was quoted" perspective.
Despite what you think, "NO YOU'RE WRONG YOU'RE A NEOCON!!!!" is not a sensible all-purpose answer.
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
Number 10 is the sociopath's way of summarizing the issue.
I guess that's logical from a Neocon, regime-change perspective.
No, it's logical from the "reading the plain language that was quoted" perspective.
Despite what you think, "NO YOU'RE WRONG YOU'RE A NEOCON!!!!" is not a sensible all-purpose answer.
Idiocy. Paul can't help it.
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
nohero said:
paulsurovell said:
10. The way the US withdrew from NE Syria was damaging, but the principle of withdrawal was correct, as was the principle of withdrawal from Lebanon in 1983. The real mistake was believing that the US could solve regional ethnic & religious disputes with military occupation.
Number 10 is the sociopath's way of summarizing the issue.
I guess that's logical from a Neocon, regime-change perspective.
No, it's logical from the "reading the plain language that was quoted" perspective.
Despite what you think, "NO YOU'RE WRONG YOU'RE A NEOCON!!!!" is not a sensible all-purpose answer.
You missed my point. You are right from a Neocon perspective.
Everyone is “right” from your perspective, paulsurovell.
Which is hilarious, because you’re barely to the left, politically-speaking.
Per UN figures: nearly 200k people have now been displaced in what had been a stable NE Syria (mostly women and children) with over 10k having already arrived in northern Iraq. UNHCR is appealing for international resources. https://t.co/t13ZjwT7iP pic.twitter.com/qirdtA9JWP
Trump's pledge to take Syrian oil is obviously illegal and should be condemned:
https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/trumps-baffling-plan-to-pillage-syrias-oil
paulsurovell said:
Trump's pledge to take Syrian oil is obviously illegal and should be condemned:
https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/trumps-baffling-plan-to-pillage-syrias-oil
Selling out the Kurds then trying to seize oil. He's a caricature of Republicans, literally "blood for oil."
paulsurovell said:
Trump's pledge to take Syrian oil is obviously illegal and should be condemned:
https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/trumps-baffling-plan-to-pillage-syrias-oil
When's the South Mountain Peace Action rally in Ricalton Square being held?
ridski said:
paulsurovell said:
Trump's pledge to take Syrian oil is obviously illegal and should be condemned:
https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/trumps-baffling-plan-to-pillage-syrias-oil
When's the South Mountain Peace Action rally in Ricalton Square being held?
We're hoping to do a joint political theatre venture with www.suburbanlegendarts.com
Edited to add: You can be Trump.
Tulsi supports the 9/11 victims in their demand for the FBI and DOJ to de-classify files on Saudi Arabia's role in 9/11.
paulsurovell said:
We're hoping to do a joint political theatre venture with www.suburbanlegendarts.com
Edited to add: You can be Trump.
We're in, but you'll have to finance it, we're in the middle of a production right now.
Thank you to the OP for replacing the offensive original title and subject of this thread.
ridski said:
paulsurovell said:
We're hoping to do a joint political theatre venture with www.suburbanlegendarts.com
Edited to add: You can be Trump.
We're in, but you'll have to finance it, we're in the middle of a production right now.
We raised $75 at Green Day. That should do it.
paulsurovell said:
We raised $75 at Green Day. That should do it.
Show us the script and we'll let you know.
Alternatively, sponsor our other show and help us give more money to other deserving charities such as St. Huberts and Bridges Outreach.
https://www.suburbanlegendarts.com/about-us/support-us/
Or come out to our dance+karaoke fundraiser on November 23rd at the South Orange Elks Lodge.
http://www.njpanto.com/bealegend/
Or come and see our show running at the Burgdorff Center in Maplewood on the first 3 weekends in January.
Saudis illegally investigating their critics on Twitter:
Good article on the illegality of Trump's order for US troops to "protect Syria's oil". This is impeachable.
paulsurovell said:
Good article on the illegality of Trump's order for US troops to "protect Syria's oil". This is impeachable.
Promises made. Promises kept.
ridski said:
paulsurovell said:
Good article on the illegality of Trump's order for US troops to "protect Syria's oil". This is impeachable.
Promises made. Promises kept.
Article from before the 2016 election ⤴️
ridski said:
paulsurovell said:
Good article on the illegality of Trump's order for US troops to "protect Syria's oil". This is impeachable.
Promises made. Promises kept.
Promises can be impeached, but in this case we're talking about a broken promise:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-trumps-syria-pullout-lies-a-campaign-pledge-11570568676
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And this:
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/10/17/assad-syria-turkey-kurds-leadership/