The Tearing Apart of the Democratic Party
STANV said:
Some Campaign staffers in 1988 stole lines from a speech by the leader of the British Labour Party. That's about it.
Biden misrepresented entire sections of his life story to match the lines that he stole from Kinnock. Its the guys life story. Staffers shouldn't be able to convince a candidate to tell the story of a life they never lived without them noticing. I
Kinnock added, "Joe and I last saw each other in early 2008 when I made an official visit to Washington as chair of the British Council … He introduced me to his staff as his 'greatest ever speech writer … ' laughter all around. At that visit, he was the first person to tell me that Barack Obama would be president. Sadly, I didn’t put a bet on. He subsequently arranged for my wife and I to attend various functions at the 2009 Inauguration. We haven’t been in touch since — no problems, just time."
drummerboy said:
Klinker said:
STANV said:
When it comes to Biden you do not know what you are talking about.
Biden's repeated plagiarisms, across the entirety of his life, are well documented.
You are really exaggerating the import of this.
Its part of a lifelong pattern of dishonesty. He lies about marching with MLK, he lies about opposing the War, he lies like a rug.
Morganna said:
I hate candidates fighting or displaying cruelty. I want to see debating. A bit of passive aggression. A helping of sarcasm introduced with the traditional, "The gentlemen from Vermont ..... " ,and then the argument is delivered.
I think Adam Schiff has it down. He can deliver a line with absolute coldness and never appear rattled. I actually thought he would run.
^This.
I rather the candidates spend more time explaining their platform, policies and how all will be implemented WITHOUT the personal. Look what happened to Eric Swalwell and Julian Castro when they personally attacked Biden and other senior presidential candidates during the debates. Gone and their poll numbers tanked.
Adam Schiff was great during the hearings. Even though he was in constant attack by the Republicans, he never flinch and made his point without getting personal.
Obama (Mr. Cool Breeze) was great at debating. One of the best in my life time. He delivered shade with dignity and grace.
phenixrising said:
Obama (Mr. Cool Breeze) was great at debating. One of the best in my life time. He delivered shade with dignity and grace.
Famous for his "likable enough" line. Plus he went up against McCain and Romney in the big debates. We definitely are no longer in the Age of McCain and Romney.
Klinker said:
drummerboy said:
Klinker said:
STANV said:
When it comes to Biden you do not know what you are talking about.
Biden's repeated plagiarisms, across the entirety of his life, are well documented.
You are really exaggerating the import of this.
Its part of a lifelong pattern of dishonesty. He lies about marching with MLK, he lies about opposing the War, he lies like a rug.
Joe Biden is prone to embellishment. He's like the uncle or grandfather who goes off at the dinner table stretching the story. Lying is a strong word. If you want "lying" look no further than the White House.
I know have your own personal jihad against Biden however, most voters nationally believe he could beat the clown in the White House. The clown is more afraid of him than the other candidates. Why? Because he appeals to the same base who voted for Obama and in the last election, voted for Trump. The Blue-Collar voter, who are white and nonwhite. Same with the minority vote.
Elizabeth Warren connects with the people on a personal level and cuts through the noise without getting personal. I can see why past Bernie supporters are now supporting her.
You can progress for change, but not at the expense of alienating others in your party. And I disagree with your assessment of calling moderates, conservatives. There are plenty of moderates who believe progressive policies but at a different pace.
"The difference between a moderate and progressive Democrat is really a question of how fast that change should occur. Moderates may say, ‘Let’spush the utility companies for more clean energy.’ Progressives bypass the utilities and launch CleanPowerSF. Moderates fought for civil unions. Progressives started marrying people.”
U.S. Rep. Xavier Becerra, D-Los Angeles
phenixrising said:
The clown is more afraid of him than the other candidates.
Trump isn't afraid of Biden, he's grooming Biden. Trump knows that Biden is the one candidate he can beat.
Klinker said:
Trump isn't afraid of Biden, he's grooming Biden. Trump knows that Biden is the one candidate he can beat.
I think to certain voters, Biden feels safe. Tested.
Other voters want real change and that translates to some, like myself, as a female President, to others its a Democratic Socialist and to a different group, a young, smart, gay man.
But the urge to go safe can not be denied. It appeals to a segment of the voting population who does not need to be motivated, who will just go out and vote.
phenixrising said:
Joe Biden is prone to embellishment. He's like the uncle or grandfather who goes off at the dinner table stretching the story. Lying is a strong word.
He embellished his record of opposing busing into a story about marching with MLK*?
In the military, they call that kind of lying "stolen valor"
* A story his aides begged him not to tell because they knew it wasn't true but which he insisted on telling time after time after time.
Klinker said:
phenixrising said:
The clown is more afraid of him than the other candidates.
Trump isn't afraid of Biden, he's grooming Biden. Trump knows that Biden is the one candidate he can beat.
LOL! And that's why the clown went through great lengths to dig up dirt on Biden. So much, that he's the third President to be impeached.
Was it worth it? Not if you want to serve a second term so bad.
“When I marched in the civil rights movement, I did not march with a 12-point program,” Mr. Biden thundered, testing his presidential message in February 1987 before a New Hampshire audience. “I marched with tens of thousands of others to change attitudes. And we changed attitudes.”
More than once, advisers had gently reminded Mr. Biden of the problem with this formulation: He had not actually marched during the civil rights movement. And more than once, Mr. Biden assured them he understood — and kept telling the story anyway.
His aides reminded him that the story wasn't true. He acknowledged that it wasn't true. And he told it anyways, time after time.
I am sorry. That's not exaggeration. That's not spinning a yarn. That is flat out, boldfaced lying for the sake of lying and it is shameful.
To borrow a phrase from AOC staffer Dennis Seelbach, that is disgusting.
Biden tried to b.s. his way out of his Iraq War support last night too. He pretty much totally lied about it.
drummerboy said:
Biden tried to b.s. his way out of his Iraq War support last night too. He pretty much totally lied about it.
This idea that simply not being Trump can excuse away any collection of faults is problematic.
drummerboy said:
Biden tried to b.s. his way out of his Iraq War support last night too. He pretty much totally lied about it.
" When former Vice President Joe Biden was asked about his vote to invade Iraq in 2002 during CNN’s Democratic debate Tuesday, he didn’t claim he really opposed the decision like he had done in debates prior. He didn’t defend the “yes” vote for war. He apologized flat out, a move critics of his have been waiting on for quite some time. “It was a mistake and I acknowledge that,” Biden said."
phenixrising said:
drummerboy said:
Biden tried to b.s. his way out of his Iraq War support last night too. He pretty much totally lied about it.
" When former Vice President Joe Biden was asked about his vote to invade Iraq in 2002 during CNN’s Democratic debate Tuesday, he didn’t claim he really opposed the decision like he had done in debates prior. He didn’t defend the “yes” vote for war. He apologized flat out, a move critics of his have been waiting on for quite some time. “It was a mistake and I acknowledge that,” Biden said."
Maybe but you can be sure that if supporting the Iraq War suddenly became popular again he would backtrack on that. Or, maybe, he might just say it never happened.
The man has no integrity whatsoever.
This is what the primaries are for. Getting rid of non viable candidates like Joe Biden. Its worked twice before, lets just hope that today's voters show the same wisdom that their predecessors showed in 1988 and 2008.
Klinker said:
This is what the primaries are for. Getting rid of non viable candidates like Joe Biden. Its worked twice before, lets just hope that today's voters show the same wisdom that their predecessors showed in 1988 and 2008.
WTF is your singular hatred for Biden all about? Did he do something personal to you that you're too ashamed to admit? Irrational hatred for a human being is dangerous. You should seek help, immediately.
Dennis_Seelbach said:
WTF is your singular hatred for Biden all about?
His insistence on running in the primary when he can't win the General is threatening the future of my (OUR) country.
I also am not that crazy about his wandering hands and his compulsive lying (see above).
I've said all this before and it seems pretty straight forward to me. Can you tell me which part you don't understand?
Dennis_Seelbach said:
WTF is your singular hatred for Biden all about?
It is concerning that you can't make a simple post without dropping an F bomb or a personal insult. You should seek help, immediately. We all love you here Denny and we just want what's best for you.
Klinker said:
To borrow a phrase from AOC staffer Dennis Seelbach, that is disgusting.
If he were employed by the Administrative Office of the Courts he would not be commenting on politics under what I assume to be his real name.
ml1 said:
At this time in 2016 the Republican primary contenders were tearing each other apart. As were the Democrats in '08.
It's the infighting within the Democratic Party groups that I'm worried about. Again, the progressives vs. moderates/centrists.
"One of the things I do worry about sometimes among progressives in the United States, is a certain kind of rigidity where we say, 'Uh, I'm sorry, this is how it's going to be,' and then we start sometimes creating what's called a 'circular firing squad,' where you start shooting at your allies because one of them is straying from purity on the issues.
You have to recognize that the way we've structured democracy requires you to take into account people who don't agree with you, and that by definition means you're not going to get 100 percent of what you want. You can't set up a system in which you don't compromise on anything, but you also can't operate in a system where you compromise on everything."
Former President Barack Obama
https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/06/politics/obama-progressive-party-democrats/index.html
phenixrising said:
drummerboy said:
Biden tried to b.s. his way out of his Iraq War support last night too. He pretty much totally lied about it.
" When former Vice President Joe Biden was asked about his vote to invade Iraq in 2002 during CNN’s Democratic debate Tuesday, he didn’t claim he really opposed the decision like he had done in debates prior. He didn’t defend the “yes” vote for war. He apologized flat out, a move critics of his have been waiting on for quite some time. “It was a mistake and I acknowledge that,” Biden said."
no,no.
He now contends that he opposed the war almost immediately after the war started. That's a lie. He supported the war well into 2004.
Steve said:
Not the AOUSC, but Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
The Administrative Office of the Courts in NJ is always abbreviated AOC.
You sure it isn’t an airline? I once flew in from Miami Beach by AOC.
STANV said:
The Administrative Office of the Courts in NJ is always abbreviated AOC.
I practice mostly in federal courts (in NY to boot) so that's where I went with your comment.
DaveSchmidt said:
You sure it isn’t an airline? I once flew in from Miami Beach by AOC.
I think that’s BOAC.
DaveSchmidt said:
You sure it isn’t an airline? I once flew in from Miami Beach by AOC.
You don't know how lucky you are.
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You are really exaggerating the import of this.