The challenges ahead for Pope Francis, Catholics, and the Church worldwide

IM80 said:

All we have to do is pray for his success.

We prayed for the last pope's success. How'd that work out?

Obviously, we didn't pray hard enough!

That's all very nice and I would agree that this pope seems like a very humble, nice man. But the problems of the church were not that it had a Pope who wasn't a humble, nice man. Frankly, that part doesn't matter one bit when you have thousands of innocent children whose lives have been ruined by a bunch of people who were never held liable. Not only not held liable but actully allowed to go about their business as if they were baove consequence. There is only one thing this Pope needs to do " differently" that will matter.

But...but...this pope doesn't wear red shoes! All is forgiven!!!

IM80 said:

I would like to give Pope Francis the opportunity to do the job he was elected to do. All we have to do is pray for his success.

Exactly !!

ktc said:

IM80 said:

All we have to do is pray for his success.

We prayed for the last pope's success. How'd that work out?

All popes are different ..

Pope Francis has that sparkle that Pope Benedict didn't have ...

But lack of " sparkle" wasn't the problem with the Catholic Church. I could care less if the guy sparkles or not or is humble or not if he cleans up his house and the mess his predecessors left him. THAT is what was needed, not a sparkly guy. That being said, I give him 30 days, maybe 60 to review all the facts, all the documentation, understand what happened and come up with some sort of plan to address. If we hear nothing from him on the molestation of children by May or so, all the sparkle in the world isn't going to matter and the Church is doomed.

Peace Prayer of St. Francis of Assisi

Lord, make me an instrument of your peace;
where there is hatred, let me sow love;
when there is injury, pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
and where there is sadness, joy.
Grant that I may not so much seek
to be consoled as to console;
to be understood, as to understand,
to be loved as to love;
for it is in giving that we receive,
it is in pardoning that we are pardoned,
and it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.

conandrob240 said:

I give him 30 days, maybe 60 to review all the facts, all the documentation, understand what happened and come up with some sort of plan to address.

Or what? You'll leave the Church?

IM80 said:

When so much anger and self-righteousness is expressed toward the Catholic Church, my guess is that the cause is often the 8000 lb elephant in the living room, not the obvious topic on the table (or thread in this case).

Using the position that there can be no redemption for sinners, will the world be a better place? .

The issue here isn't redemption for sinners it is prison for rapists. Until you and yours and your leaders can wrap your hidebound minds around that simple concept the Catholic Church will continue down the path to moral bankruptcy.

bikefixed said:

What is known is that Francis did work behind the scenes to protect some clergy that opposed the regime.

Or so Francis says. My understanding is that in Argentina, this is the subject of some debate.

IM80 said:

Obviously, we didn't pray hard enough!

... or maybe there is no such thing as a transcendent god who gives a rat's ass about what happens on 'urf. If there was, we would all be dead. Citizens of every nation have prayed at one time or another for the destruction of citizens of another nation.

"The War Prayer," by Mark Twain.

Jerseyjack says: ".. or maybe there is no such thing as a transcendent god who gives a rat's ass about what happens on 'urf. If there was, we would all be dead. Citizens of every nation have prayed at one time or another for the destruction of citizens of another nation."

Must be mighty hard to get out of bed in the morning!
:-(

IM80 said:

Jerseyjack says: ".. or maybe there is no such thing as a transcendent god who gives a rat's ass about what happens on 'urf. If there was, we would all be dead. Citizens of every nation have prayed at one time or another for the destruction of citizens of another nation."

Must be mighty hard to get out of bed in the morning!
:-(

How so?

Because the egomaniacal invisible man in the sky holding him down?

IM80 said:

Jerseyjack says: ".. or maybe there is no such thing as a transcendent god who gives a rat's ass about what happens on 'urf. If there was, we would all be dead. Citizens of every nation have prayed at one time or another for the destruction of citizens of another nation."

Must be mighty hard to get out of bed in the morning!
:-(

-- not at all. I don't have to worry about getting my butt up for morning Mass, back for Matins, evening prayers, tithing to support the promulgation of nonsense, Holy Days, Sundays, fish days, (even though I like fish), confession, and communion.

And here's the best part .... I ain't going to hell because I don't do these things.

Some of us manage to get out of bed in the morning just fine without faith or an effervescent attitude toward life. It's not that hard.

jerseyjack said:

... or maybe there is no such thing as a transcendent god who gives a rat's ass about what happens on 'urf. If there was, we would all be dead. Citizens of every nation have prayed at one time or another for the destruction of citizens of another nation.

"The War Prayer," by Mark Twain.

Look, I like Twain, but he's a lightweight when compared to Tolstoy, Dostoyevsky, Joyce or O'Connor!

rukidding said:

Look, I like Twain, but he's a lightweight when compared to Tolstoy

Apples and Buicks. Only a fool would try to make such a comparison.

If I were an apologist with a conscience, I would find it pretty darn hard to raise my head.

Well, that's you then.

I'm not an apologist because I have a conscience.

And I am giving Francis a chance before I go back to my bitterness over the sex scandal - because I can see more than black and white.

bikefixed said:

And I am giving Francis a chance before I go back to my bitterness over the sex scandal - because I can see more than black and white.

Ummm.... the scandal was about rape, not sex.

" go back to bitterness"? Really? You stopped being bitter about it at some point? Why? Children were molested and it was covered up. No one paid the price ( except the kids). Why would any sane human being ever stop being bitter about it?

Yes, a lot of rape occurred. Wrong terminology. My bad. Should have said molestation or rape.

Bite me, con. You have no *****ing clue about my motivations.

Why are you angry at me? I am not following. Motivation for what? Why would anyone stop being angry or bitter about the rape of children?

Anyone else notice that L.P seems to be overly fond of using the word "rape" repeatedly?
I know that rhetorical question will just open the flood gates, but, seriously, dude, get help.

I am willing to give the guy a chance to do his due diligence and make an informed plan of action. That being said, one of his opening statements should have been that one of his key missions ( in addition to his focus on the poor and all else he said) was going to be taking action on the child abuse/ rape scandal. That would have been very effective to say it and then go off and research it and come back with a plan.

What euphemism for rape do you prefer, finnegan? Does that make it feel better?