JIMMY DORE is "ready to go out and get this [Covid-19] virus and get back to life"
nan said:
DaveSchmidt said:
PVW’s point is that Britain will not be (per nan’s quote, which he referenced) “dropping the euro.”
Nan, your turn to explain why that doesn’t matter.
RFA, your turn to do whatever it is you do.
I quickly typed up a synopsis to this video. If you think there is something inaccurate than you can LISTEN to the video to check on what was said and let me know, without trying to humiliate me, what I need to correct.
nohero requested a response on this video. It took some time to listen and type that up. You can thank me for my effort at any time. I will not hold my breath. On MOL, no good deed goes unpunished.
It would be nice, sometime, if you actually commented on the contents of my posts instead of just hunting through them looking for typos and small mistakes.
If the video doesn't talk about dropping the Euro, just say you got that wrong, and no big deal. If it does, then this does go to the substance of the video, since the UK is not on the Euro, so someone pushing "dropping the Euro" as an issue should raise some flags as to whether they are a reliable source.
As I've already said, i don't watch these videos, but I noticed that both you and nohero have noted that the video talks about dropping the Euro, so I suspect this wasn't a mistake in your note taking.
Someone with a famous and influential father taking a job is not regime change. The US and EU pushing a country to fire a corrupt prosecutor is not the same as a president extorting a country to aid his personal reelection efforts.
You might disapprove of all three of these actions, but they three very different actions.
nan said:
I went through the video, as requested by nohero, once and that was enough. I needed to clean my house. What did you think of Mark Blyth's ideas? You know, the topic of the video?
Mark Blyth makes sense. Dore makes a hash of him, though.* Blyth doesn’t claim, as the video’s title does, that Brexit is good for working people. They’re screwed either way, until the governing elites are forced to change their ways. He opposes central continental policymaking and suggests that Brexit could be the crisis that destroys the euro (debatable), but he’s pessimistic that “siloed” economies with home control would be any better for workers under the same elites.
Hearing Dore (paraphrasing: “The MPs didn’t elect Corbyn, the people did!”) explain Blyth is like reading Paul lecture on the Kurds.
* It’s worth noting that both videos — Blyth’s and Dore’s — are from the summer of the Brexit referendum in 2016. Since then, Blyth has been critical of Britain’s Brexit strategy.
PVW said:
Someone with a famous and influential father taking a job is not regime change. The US and EU pushing a country to fire a corrupt prosecutor is not the same as a president extorting a country to aid his personal reelection efforts.
You might disapprove of all three of these actions, but they three very different actions.
Prior to Hunter taking his job there was regime change in Ukraine facilitated by Biden.
DaveSchmidt said:
Mark Blyth makes sense. Dore makes a hash of him, though.* Blyth doesn’t claim, as the video’s title does, that Brexit is good for working people. They’re screwed either way, until the governing elites are forced to change their ways. He opposes central continental policymaking and suggests that Brexit could be the crisis that destroys the euro (debatable), but he’s pessimistic that “siloed” economies with home control would be any better for workers under the same elites.
Hearing Dore (paraphrasing: “The MPs didn’t elect Corbyn, the people did!”) explain Blyth is like reading Paul lecture on the Kurds.
* It’s worth noting that both videos — Blyth’s and Dore’s — are from the summer of the Brexit referendum in 2016. Since then, Blyth has been critical of Britain’s Brexit strategy.
Thank you! See this is the DaveSchmidt I like!
I agree the title is misleading--I think that's as far as nohero got.
I think you are a bit too critical of Dore. He openly admits that he is unqualified to be a commentator on these kinds of topics, but since the real news media won't either he does the best he can. He is curious and tries to educate himself and shares the things he finds. I am grateful for learning about Mark Blyth through him. You won't see that on MSNBC/CNN. He exposes people to interesting topics, they can then go learn more about elsewhere.
paulsurovell said:
What happened (at 52:00):
Thanks, Paul. As explained by Biden in the video, the United States and others that were helping Ukraine towards a healthy democracy provided the impetus to remove a public official who was using his office to hold back that progress.
The idea that it's being used be Bernie fans and others to attack Biden is despicable.
Here's contemporaneous coverage of that, from March 29, 2016:
Bowing to pressure from international donors, the Ukrainian Parliament voted on Tuesday to remove a prosecutor general who had clung to power for months despite visible signs of corruption.
…
The United States and other Western nations had for months called for the ousting of Mr. Shokin, who was widely criticized for turning a blind eye to corrupt practices and for defending the interests of a venal and entrenched elite. He was one of several political figures in Kiev whom reformers and Western diplomats saw as a worrying indicator of a return to past corrupt practices, two years after a revolution that was supposed to put a stop to self-dealing by those in power.
As the problems festered, Kiev drew increasingly sharp criticism from Western diplomats and leaders. In a visit in December, Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr. said corruption was eating Ukraine “like a cancer.” Christine Lagarde, the managing director of the International Monetary Fund, which props up Ukraine financially, said last month that progress was so slow in fighting corruption that “it’s hard to see how the I.M.F.-supported program can continue.”
…
Since his appointment a year ago, Mr. Shokin had been criticized for not prosecuting officials, businessmen and members of Parliament for their roles in corrupt schemes during the government of former President Viktor F. Yanukovych.
The whole article: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/30/world/europe/political-stability-in-the-balance-as-ukraine-ousts-top-prosecutor.html?module=inline
If people who want to comment on Biden and Ukraine read these facts, it shouldn't be necessary for anyone here to have to explain these facts again.
PVW said:
nan said:
He places Brexit in that context and explains why some aspects of it, such as dropping the Euro and wages might be better for workers.
What currency does the UK use currently? What currency would they use should they leave the EU?
I know PVW meant well, but there are some people for which the Socratic method does not work. They don't get the point.
Instead, simple declarative sentences (in all-caps if need be) sometimes are the only tool.
Now, Ms. Nan, to repeat something wrote when I asked about Jimmy Dore's Brexit argument:
THE UNITED KINGDOM OF GREAT BRITAIN AND NORTHERN IRELAND IS NOT ON THE EURO.
You're being duped by two guys who hope their audience doesn't realize that, as they make their arguments about wonderful Brexit will be for working people.
terp said:
Here's America helping Ukraine towards a healthy democracy...
Great movie! Has details on Biden corruption not mentioned in the New York Times article cited by nohero above to defend Biden. I think overthrowing other countries is illegal, right?
nohero said:
I know PVW meant well, but there are some people for which the Socratic method does not work. They don't get the point.
Instead, simple declarative sentences (in all-caps if need be) sometimes are the only tool.
Now, Ms. Nan, to repeat something wrote when I asked about Jimmy Dore's Brexit argument:
THE UNITED KINGDOM OF GREAT BRITAIN AND NORTHERN IRELAND IS NOT ON THE EURO.
You're being duped by two guys who hope their audience doesn't realize that, as they make their arguments about wonderful Brexit will be for working people.
Are you seriously saying that Mark Blyth, a professor at Brown University does not know what currency is used in the UK?
Also, as others, not just me, have reported the video does not state that Brexit will be wonderful for working people. It talks about the bad situation that working people are in and tries to help us understand the anger and lack of alternatives that led them to choose Brexit.
Maybe you need to watch again, or for the first time.
nan said:
terp said:
Here's America helping Ukraine towards a healthy democracy...
Great movie! Has details on Biden corruption not mentioned in the New York Times article cited by nohero above to defend Biden. I think overthrowing other countries is illegal, right?
What about violently seizing a large portion of a neighboring country?
If the country that was the victim of such aggression votes to eject a government that was friendly with the aggressor in favor of one opposed to it, is that a problem?
If a chorus of voices insists that the victimized country has suffered a coup, but are strangely silent about the violent seizure of territory by the aggressor country, should that raise some flags?
PVW said:
What about violently seizing a large portion of a neighboring country?
If the country that was the victim of such aggression votes to eject a government that was friendly with the aggressor in favor of one opposed to it, is that a problem?
If a chorus of voices insists that the victimized country has suffered a coup, but are strangely silent about the violent seizure of territory by the aggressor country, should that raise some flags?
Watch the movie. That never happened.
nan said:
nohero said:
I know PVW meant well, but there are some people for which the Socratic method does not work. They don't get the point.
Instead, simple declarative sentences (in all-caps if need be) sometimes are the only tool.
Now, Ms. Nan, to repeat something wrote when I asked about Jimmy Dore's Brexit argument:
THE UNITED KINGDOM OF GREAT BRITAIN AND NORTHERN IRELAND IS NOT ON THE EURO.
You're being duped by two guys who hope their audience doesn't realize that, as they make their arguments about wonderful Brexit will be for working people.
Are you seriously saying that Mark Blyth, a professor at Brown University does not know what currency is used in the UK?
I'm seriously saying that the UK has its own currency, the Pound. Euros in Great Britain are like Canadian Dollars at the Jersey Shore. People show up with them, but that doesn't mean that they're the actual currency in use.
Are you still not clear on this, Ms. Nan?
nan said:
PVW said:
What about violently seizing a large portion of a neighboring country?
If the country that was the victim of such aggression votes to eject a government that was friendly with the aggressor in favor of one opposed to it, is that a problem?
If a chorus of voices insists that the victimized country has suffered a coup, but are strangely silent about the violent seizure of territory by the aggressor country, should that raise some flags?
Watch the movie. That never happened.
Watch real life. Russia seized part of Ukraine, and is supporting separatists in other parts.
nan said:
PVW said:
What about violently seizing a large portion of a neighboring country?
If the country that was the victim of such aggression votes to eject a government that was friendly with the aggressor in favor of one opposed to it, is that a problem?
If a chorus of voices insists that the victimized country has suffered a coup, but are strangely silent about the violent seizure of territory by the aggressor country, should that raise some flags?
Watch the movie. That never happened.
Which part specifically never happened? Russia did invade and annex a good chunk of Ukraine. Are you disputing this?
nohero said:
I'm seriously saying that the UK has its own currency, the Pound. Euros in Great Britain are like Canadian Dollars at the Jersey Shore. People show up with them, but that doesn't mean that they're the actual currency in use.
Are you still not clear on this, Ms. Nan?
Thank you, Dr.nohero
PVW said:
Which part specifically never happened? Russia did invade and annex a good chunk of Ukraine. Are you disputing this?
Yes. Watch the movie.
People should remember that Crimea has very significant strategic value to Russia. It's its only warm weather military port. Crimea was made part of Ukraine by Khrushchev as an administrative move. I believe most people there are Russian speaking.
I don't say this to defend Putin, but when we are willing to intervene as far away from home as we are, Crimea has been well within the Russian umbrella for a long time and has significant military value. This is not some example of some super aggression and does not rise near to the level of the aggression that the US Military has been up to the last generation or two.
terp said:
People should remember that Crimea has very significant strategic value to Russia. It's its only warm weather military port. Crimea was made part of Ukraine by Khrushchev as an administrative move. I believe most people there are Russian speaking.
I don't say this to defend Putin, but when we are willing to intervene as far away from home as we are, Crimea has been well within the Russian umbrella for a long time and has significant military value. This is not some example of some super aggression and does not rise near to the level of the aggression that the US Military has been up to the last generation or two.
That's actually defending Putin. And excusing Russia's annexation. And ignoring Donbas.
PVW said:
Wow. I've got nothing. If we don't have a shared reality any more, I don't even know what there is to say.
Watch the movie. The people of Crimea wanted to go with Russia rather than go with the Nazis in the west. The Nazis that were supported by the U.S. Government. This is why I called John McCain a war criminal.
nohero said:
terp said:
People should remember that Crimea has very significant strategic value to Russia. It's its only warm weather military port. Crimea was made part of Ukraine by Khrushchev as an administrative move. I believe most people there are Russian speaking.
I don't say this to defend Putin, but when we are willing to intervene as far away from home as we are, Crimea has been well within the Russian umbrella for a long time and has significant military value. This is not some example of some super aggression and does not rise near to the level of the aggression that the US Military has been up to the last generation or two.
That's actually defending Putin. And excusing Russia's annexation. And ignoring Donbas.
Please educate me.
The people of Scotland voted to stay in Europe. Can France annex them?
ridski said:
The people of Scotland voted to stay in Europe. Can France annex them?
Ask James Brennan
nan said:
drummerboy said:
gaaaah
I listened to about 1:20 and gave up. He's grossly simplifying what we know to be a very complex situation involving most of the EU in regards to the do-nothing prosecutor.
Did we and the EU strong-arm Ukraine. Yeah.
get me my laudanum, I'm having a spell.
Anyway, carry that water. It will serve Trump well.
It'll f*** the rest of us though.
" t'll f*** the rest of us though." = Joe Biden as the nominee
Right he is simplifying because it is very simple. The US should not be involved in regime change and telling other countries how to hire and fire personnel. You might need a bucket of laudanum and some smelling salts to get through this one.
The Untold Story of the Trump-Ukraine ‘Scandal’: The Routine Corruption of US Foreign Policy
Click to Read More
Excellent article. Lauria didn't mention that Trump's abuse of power involved personal political gain which I think merits censure, but that doesn't compare to the US role in overthrowing the elected Ukrainian government as an abuse of power.
terp said:
Here's America helping Ukraine towards a healthy democracy...
But you are talking to guys who won't even admit that genocidal sanctions constitute US "meddling" in Venezuela:
terp said:
Ask James Brennan
While I’m there, should I ask John Smith and David Jones, too?
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" t'll f*** the rest of us though." = Joe Biden as the nominee
Right he is simplifying because it is very simple. The US should not be involved in regime change and telling other countries how to hire and fire personnel. You might need a bucket of laudanum and some smelling salts to get through this one.
The Untold Story of the Trump-Ukraine ‘Scandal’: The Routine Corruption of US Foreign Policy
https://consortiumnews.com/2019/09/26/what-isnt-mentioned-about-the-trump-ukraine-scandal-the-routine-corruption-of-us-foreign-policy/