Howard Schultz for President 2020?

tjohn said:

We need to live within our means whether by spending less or taxing more.  I would gladly vote for a fiscal conservative if they weren't adorned with the social conservative crap.  I don't think the progressive vision is as popular as people in the People's Republic of Maplewood think it is.

I'm not sure the People's Republic of Maplewood even represents Maplewood.  Clinton beat Sanders 2-1 in Maplewood.   

drummerboy said:

"Fiscal conservatism" is meaningless in this day and age. What does that actually mean?  I'm tired of people talking about the finances of the federal government as analogous to household finances. That's just economic illiteracy, which we can ill afford.

What does "living within our means" actually mean, when you can print money? People have been predicting disaster because of our debt for decades now. Isn't it time to realize that that's all bullshite? Somehow we can afford off the books spending for wars, and deficits in the cause of giving corporations and billionaires tax breaks, but heaven forbid we use those same techniques for the safety net or filling potholes.

Let's assume that China continues to grow and modernize her economy.  At some point in, say, 25 years, when we aren't the largest economy and China has evolved to the point where her currency is viewed as a reserve currency, we can and will experience an economic collapse.

Of course, we could print money to get out of debt.  That worked really well for the Weimar Republic.

tjohn said:

drummerboy said:"Fiscal conservatism" is meaningless in this day and age. What does that actually mean?  I'm tired of people talking about the finances of the federal government as analogous to household finances. That's just economic illiteracy, which we can ill afford.

What does "living within our means" actually mean, when you can print money? People have been predicting disaster because of our debt for decades now. Isn't it time to realize that that's all bullshite? Somehow we can afford off the books spending for wars, and deficits in the cause of giving corporations and billionaires tax breaks, but heaven forbid we use those same techniques for the safety net or filling potholes.

Let's assume that China continues to grow and modernize her economy.  At some point in, say, 25 years, when we aren't the largest economy and China has evolved to the point where her currency is viewed as a reserve currency, we can and will experience an economic collapse.
Of course, we could print money to get out of debt.  That worked really well for the Weimar Republic.

Funny - other economies manage to survive without having the reserve currency. How does that work?

And really - we should base current policies on what might happen in 25 years?

Unimpressed by this reasoning.

How about this guy?

https://www.johnkdelaney.com/

I grew up in a blue-collar family in Wood-Ridge, New Jersey. My dad was a hardworking, 60-year member of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, while my mom stayed home to raise my sister and me. Hard work runs in our family. My grandparents came to the United States from Ireland and England, and found jobs in Jersey City, NJ, where one grandfather worked in a pencil factory and the other was a dockworker. My parents instilled that same value of hard work in me. I can’t remember a time as a kid when I wasn’t working during a break from school. I’ve spent summers as a mason and excavation laborer, painter, landscaper, and most often, an electrician’s assistant, working side by side with my dad. 

 My parents never had the opportunity to attend college. But because of my mother’s influence, and with help from my father’s labor union, I was able to attend and graduate from Columbia University and Georgetown University Law Center. I paid my way through Columbia with the help of scholarships from my dad’s union, IBEW Local 164, as well as the American Legion, VFW, and the Lion’s Club. Like so many Americans, I got a helping hand from others that made all the difference and opened countless doors of opportunity for me. I understand the American Dream, because I have lived it. 

yahooyahoo said:
Where is the next generation of dynamic leaders from the Democratic party?  Clinton was 46 when elected and Obama was 47.  We keep talking about Hillary, Bernie, retired CEOs, Oprah, etc.  We need some new blood in the party.

Absolutely, but if you look early in the election cycles where they eventually prevailed, few people were talking about Clinton and Obama.

I'm a big fan of Pete Buttigeig. I hope he's able to get some traction.

drummerboy said:

Funny - other economies manage to survive without having the reserve currency. How does that work?
And really - we should base current policies on what might happen in 25 years?
Unimpressed by this reasoning.

You seem to have this idea that our economy can defy laws of gravity and that we can print and spend money forever without consequence.  There is no more reasoning with this line of thinking than there is reasoning with climate change deniers.

tjohn said:
You seem to have this idea that our economy can defy laws of gravity and that we can print and spend money forever without consequence.  There is no more reasoning with this line of thinking than there is reasoning with climate change deniers.

It's shifting around the money we have already, not printing money. There is enough money to feed everyone, yet some are going hungry. We don't have to print money to feed the poor.

Tom_Reingold said:

tjohn said:
You seem to have this idea that our economy can defy laws of gravity and that we can print and spend money forever without consequence.  There is no more reasoning with this line of thinking than there is reasoning with climate change deniers.

It's shifting around the money we have already, not printing money. There is enough money to feed everyone, yet some are going hungry. We don't have to print money to feed the poor.

No question that we could change spending priorities to good effect - less guns more butter.  And I would think that spending the amount of the tax cut on infrastructure over the same period of time would yield greater benefits for more people than the tax cuts.

tjohn said:
No question that we could change spending priorities to good effect - less guns more butter.  And I would think that spending the amount of the tax cut on infrastructure over the same period of time would yield greater benefits for more people than the tax cuts.

 OK so don't be so afraid of social programs. They work.

tjohn said:

drummerboy said:

Funny - other economies manage to survive without having the reserve currency. How does that work?
And really - we should base current policies on what might happen in 25 years?
Unimpressed by this reasoning.

You seem to have this idea that our economy can defy laws of gravity and that we can print and spend money forever without consequence.  There is no more reasoning with this line of thinking than there is reasoning with climate change deniers.

That's not what I'm saying - I am saying that the predictions that our current debt is unsustainable fall flat. I'm saying that our current debt level is not a crisis - as is  portrayed by well-meaning but dumb people like Schultz, and we should not be basing policies as if that were true.

And regardless - any politician who attempts to equate household finances with US finances is a freaking idiot who should never be heard from again.

LOST said:
How about this guy?
https://www.johnkdelaney.com/


I grew up in a blue-collar family in Wood-Ridge, New Jersey. My dad was a hardworking, 60-year member of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, while my mom stayed home to raise my sister and me. Hard work runs in our family. My grandparents came to the United States from Ireland and England, and found jobs in Jersey City, NJ, where one grandfather worked in a pencil factory and the other was a dockworker. My parents instilled that same value of hard work in me. I can’t remember a time as a kid when I wasn’t working during a break from school. I’ve spent summers as a mason and excavation laborer, painter, landscaper, and most often, an electrician’s assistant, working side by side with my dad. 
 My parents never had the opportunity to attend college. But because of my mother’s influence, and with help from my father’s labor union, I was able to attend and graduate from Columbia University and Georgetown University Law Center. I paid my way through Columbia with the help of scholarships from my dad’s union, IBEW Local 164, as well as the American Legion, VFW, and the Lion’s Club. Like so many Americans, I got a helping hand from others that made all the difference and opened countless doors of opportunity for me. I understand the American Dream, because I have lived it. 

 I heard him on Smerconish yesterday. Basically a rehash of the statement above. While that is nice, what else does he offer?

He did work across the aisle to get 80 representatives to vote for an infrastructure bill. The bill was eventually sandbagged by the Republican majority and went nowhere.

B.T.W., no on Schultz.

Yeah, if the guy can't make a decent cup of coffee, how is he going to run the country?

Klinker said:
Yeah, if the guy can't make a decent cup of coffee, how is he going to run the country?

 ^{Ha! i avoid the place, too.}

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

LOST said:
How about this guy?
https://www.johnkdelaney.com/


I grew up in a blue-collar family in Wood-Ridge, New Jersey. My dad was a hardworking, 60-year member of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, while my mom stayed home to raise my sister and me. Hard work runs in our family. My grandparents came to the United States from Ireland and England, and found jobs in Jersey City, NJ, where one grandfather worked in a pencil factory and the other was a dockworker. My parents instilled that same value of hard work in me. I can’t remember a time as a kid when I wasn’t working during a break from school. I’ve spent summers as a mason and excavation laborer, painter, landscaper, and most often, an electrician’s assistant, working side by side with my dad. 
 My parents never had the opportunity to attend college. But because of my mother’s influence, and with help from my father’s labor union, I was able to attend and graduate from Columbia University and Georgetown University Law Center. I paid my way through Columbia with the help of scholarships from my dad’s union, IBEW Local 164, as well as the American Legion, VFW, and the Lion’s Club. Like so many Americans, I got a helping hand from others that made all the difference and opened countless doors of opportunity for me. I understand the American Dream, because I have lived it. 

 I heard him on Smerconish yesterday. Basically a rehash of the statement above. While that is nice, what else does he offer?


He did work across the aisle to get 80 representatives to vote for an infrastructure bill. The bill was eventually sandbagged by the Republican majority and went nowhere.

His website talks more about New Jersey than Maryland (which he represents).  

I will dig into his platform some more.

drummerboy said:

That's not what I'm saying - I am saying that the predictions that our current debt is unsustainable fall flat. I'm saying that our current debt level is not a crisis - as is  portrayed by well-meaning but dumb people like Schultz, and we should not be basing policies as if that were true.

And regardless - any politician who attempts to equate household finances with US finances is a freaking idiot who should never be heard from again.

 If I bump into that "well-meaning but dumb" self-made billionaire on the subway I will send him your way for an intro to economics lecture.  I'm sure he needs it.

DannyArcher said:

drummerboy said:

That's not what I'm saying - I am saying that the predictions that our current debt is unsustainable fall flat. I'm saying that our current debt level is not a crisis - as is  portrayed by well-meaning but dumb people like Schultz, and we should not be basing policies as if that were true.

And regardless - any politician who attempts to equate household finances with US finances is a freaking idiot who should never be heard from again.

 If I bump into that "well-meaning but dumb" self-made billionaire on the subway I will send him your way for an intro to economics lecture.  I'm sure he needs it.

Running a business has about zero to do with understanding macro-economics at the federal policy level. And Shultz makes that painfully obvious.

Maybe Schultz will come around and call for the federal government to print money to fund social programs. That will win him the MOL vote.

Smedley said:
Maybe Schultz will come around and call for the federal government to print money to fund social programs. That will win him the MOL vote.

I do look forward to the candidate who comes out against printing money. There must be one lurking in the Republican party.

Smedley said:
Maybe Schultz will come around and call for the federal government to print money to fund social programs. That will win him the MOL vote.

 What he should do, if he had an ounce of sense, is to cancel the Republican tax cut and turn it into a middle class and lower tax cut only, and a 10 year infrastructure program - financed by yes, printing money.

But no-o-o-o, he'd rather cut back Medicare and Social Security.

Idiot.

Smedley said:
I think Schultz is an intriguing possibility at this early juncture. I don't know a ton about him but overall I have a favorable impression of him. 

 Really?  Why?  He seems like a total POS to me and I drink tons of Starbucks coffee.

Smedley said:
Maybe Schultz will come around and call for the federal government to print money to fund social programs. That will win him the MOL vote.

 As opposed to printing money to fund tax cuts for billionaires. 

nan said:

Smedley said:
I think Schultz is an intriguing possibility at this early juncture. I don't know a ton about him but overall I have a favorable impression of him. 

 Really?  Why?  He seems like a total POS to me and I drink tons of Starbucks coffee.

 I like his story. Schultz seems like a straight shooter, a smart, pragmatic guy who would focus on solutions rather than ideology. At Starbucks, in addition to the company being a tremendous success, I think he’s also done a good job emphasizing corporate responsibility, more so than the average corporation. 

This is all very preliminary of course and who knows if he’ll even run, and if he does, if he’ll be any good as a candidate.  But for now I’m constructive on the guy.

And being as you pleasantly referred to Schultz as a “total POS”, I also refer you to my June 6 1:40 pm post on this thread about electability. Go ahead and nominate Sanders or Warren or some other give-away-the-store type. MOL will be fired up, and you’ll rack up the votes in CA, NJ, NY and VT, but you’ll also get a Trump landslide in 2020.

Most Polls showed Sanders beating Trump............thank the DNC for for our current President

I am not a conservative kind of guy

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_sanders-5565.html

I have absolutely no problem with a large field of primary choices.  Let me choose who I want. That's how it is supposed to work.   I'm sure a few more folks will step up.

author said:
Most Polls showed Sanders beating Trump............thank the DNC for for our current President
I am not a conservative kind of guy

They also showed Clinton beating Trump. We won't know until Sanders is the general election opponent getting directly attacked by the right wing.

It won't be pleasant. They'll bring up why did Sanders have his honeymoon in the Soviet Union? Because he's a commie at heart. Why did Sanders visit Nicaragua and join in Death to America demonstrations? Because he hates America.

They'll even have some "liberal" group touting Sanders pro-NRA gun stance, creating dissension in the liberal camp. To cut Sanders liberal vote. 

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2015/05/bernie_sanders_on_guns_vermont_independent_voted_against_gun_control_for.html

https://nypost.com/2016/03/07/nra-praises-sanders-for-opposing-gun-maker-liability/

And so on.

It was the Soviet Union that suffered and contributed the most in defeating the Nazis in Wold War 2

The war was several years old before the Allies landed at Normandy.........the 2nd front which the Russians waited so long.  The stand at Stalingrad was the turning point.........and the beginning of the long retreat for the Germans

What to see in Russia............tons of art work in many places such as the Hermitage

My brother in law and his wife have been there .  Maybe they are Reds.  Don't think so......he is the biggest proponent of free markets I know

Besides Bernie makes better coffee than Schultz

dave23 said:

Smedley said:
Maybe Schultz will come around and call for the federal government to print money to fund social programs. That will win him the MOL vote.

I do look forward to the candidate who comes out against printing money. There must be one lurking in the Republican party.

 I think (s)he went into the witness protection program.