$7 billion to bring Amazon to Newark. Its not a deal I would want to see. What do you think?

that makes us even

RobB said:

drummerboy said:

and how does the state get helped by giving up 7 billion in taxes?

I'm not sure if that's a serious question. 

But...I didn’t ask a question. 

drummerboy said:

that makes us even

RobB said:

drummerboy said:

and how does the state get helped by giving up 7 billion in taxes?

I'm not sure if that's a serious question. 

As mentioned earlier, the $7 billion comes out of new revenues generated by Amazon coming in.  It isn't pulling from existing revenues.  Whether it is a good deal or not is another matter, but it is pretty certain that they would never even consider coming in without a significant break on the taxes they will need to pay.

well, it was an implicit question.

RobB said:

But...I didn’t ask a question. 

Amazon already does have operations in Newark. Audible has been owned by Amazon for a long time.

sac said:

drummerboy said:

that makes us even

RobB said:

drummerboy said:

and how does the state get helped by giving up 7 billion in taxes?

I'm not sure if that's a serious question. 

As mentioned earlier, the $7 billion comes out of new revenues generated by Amazon coming in.  It isn't pulling from existing revenues.  Whether it is a good deal or not is another matter, but it is pretty certain that they would never even consider coming in without a significant break on the taxes they will need to pay.

+1 

I could be wrong about this since the reporting has been so thin, but I don't think NJ is proposing to rebate any of the sales taxes Amazon would pay on corporate purchases.  If this is correct, the sales taxes from Amazon itself (let alone the employees) might be tens of millions a year.

I haven't seen any thoughtful analysis of what the service load would be for HQ2 versus the economic impact, but as just a layman, I don't know how NJ wouldn't come out ahead and actually lower NJ's taxes, or at least Essex County and Newark taxes.  

Amazon's employees will have minimal involvement with the state's justice, social welfare, and Medicaid agencies.  Some will live in New York anyway and help NJ Transit and PATH's finances by reverse-commuting.  

Amazon's employees will have billions in spending power, which will be taxable.  Their real estate purchases won't directly lower tax levies (except through higher real estate transfer fees), but as they push real estate values up, at least our tax _rates_ will fall.  SOMA would probably be a big winner.

Although Amazon won't pay full property taxes, it's likely they'll build on underused, nearly vacant land in Newark that doesn't pay much in property taxes anyway and Newark will get more from PILOTed buildings than it would from nearly derelict lots.   The PILOT payments will offset Newark's regular tax levy.  If Amazon employees live in Newark and Newark's many vacant lots get developed, that'll further offset Newark's tax levy, plus provide jobs.  

If Newark develops a start-up ecosystem, that'll produce tons of economic development. 

I don't think Amazon will pick Newark, but if they did, I think it would be good for the state and fantastic for Newark and Essex County. 

I found a listing of NJ's biggest non-governmental employers that, to me, drove home how big a deal it would be for NJ to get 50,000 high-paying Amazon jobs.

NJ's biggest non-governmental employer is Wakefern, at 40,000 jobs. Then is Walmart, at 20,000.  UPS, Verizon, and a few more retailers follow.  

No disrespect to those companies, but their jobs are not high paying on average.

Johnson & Johnson is probably the biggest employer with lots of high-paying jobs, but J&J is down to only 9,600 in New Jersey.  Prudential has ~9400.  AT&T has 8300.  Merck is at 7400.  JP Morgan is at 6300.

I don't know the average salaries at J&J, the Pru, AT&T, Merck, and JPM but the five of them combined don't add up to what Amazon is saying it will bring.

https://njbmagazine.com/monthly_articles/44th-annual-top-100-employers/

When will we learn of Amazon's decision?

https://www.facebook.com/LastWeekTonight/videos/1373501886112150/