Real Estate question - what makes a bedroom a bedroom? archived
Jul 30, 2012 at 8:45am Edited
We took our realtor up to our finished attic and because our contractor put a walk in closet in an odd space she commented that we could consider this room as a 4th bedroom. Works for me!!
From what I understand you would need to have a closet, a door, a window that offers escape if there is a fire, and enough space to fit a bed.
I looked it up, rastro, but there is a hell of a lot of contradiction from the experts. And one of my realtor friends says the closet is not necessary...sigh
A Bedroom Must:
1. Have a closet if the house was built after 1945. Before then armoires were common.
2. Have its own heat. You cannot heat it by leaving the door open.
3. Have its own door into the rest of the house, you cannot 'daisy-chain' bedrooms.
4. Its own window, usually at least 1/3 of the wall in most jurisdictions so that it can be used as an exit in an emergency.
5. Be large enough to hold a bed.
1. Have a closet if the house was built after 1945. Before then armoires were common.
2. Have its own heat. You cannot heat it by leaving the door open.
3. Have its own door into the rest of the house, you cannot 'daisy-chain' bedrooms.
4. Its own window, usually at least 1/3 of the wall in most jurisdictions so that it can be used as an exit in an emergency.
5. Be large enough to hold a bed.
Probably real estate agents and appraisers have different motivations on this. I just had an appraiser come in for our refinancing. His comment was we had a nice "finished attic" but that it indeed was not a bedroom. I pointed out: 1) Closet + a larger walk-in closet 2) Steam radiator just like the other rooms in the house, 3) It's own door to the 3rd floor hallway, 4) Two windows that run along one side of the room, 5) A queen sized bed, plus two night stands, a dresser and a book shelf.
So while we purchased a 4 bedroom house, and previously refinanced a 4 bedroom house, and are being assessed with a 4 bedroom house, this guy who has "been in the business for decades" says no way.
Go figure.
So while we purchased a 4 bedroom house, and previously refinanced a 4 bedroom house, and are being assessed with a 4 bedroom house, this guy who has "been in the business for decades" says no way.
Go figure.
Jul 31, 2012 at 2:38am Edited
rholowczak-I sure hope we do not get the same appraiser that you did when we sell!! Our "attic" room sounds exactly like yours....except that we have 3 windows...1 in front of room and two in back-
I am with bgs, I don't understand how that could not be a 4th bedroom!
rholowczak said:
Probably real estate agents and appraisers have different motivations on this. I just had an appraiser come in for our refinancing. His comment was we had a nice "finished attic" but that it indeed was not a bedroom. I pointed out: 1) Closet + a larger walk-in closet 2) Steam radiator just like the other rooms in the house, 3) It's own door to the 3rd floor hallway, 4) Two windows that run along one side of the room, 5) A queen sized bed, plus two night stands, a dresser and a book shelf.
So while we purchased a 4 bedroom house, and previously refinanced a 4 bedroom house, and are being assessed with a 4 bedroom house, this guy who has "been in the business for decades" says no way.
Go figure.
This is the new trend among appraisers. Same thing happened to me. Bought a 4 bedroom house and it was appraised as a 3 bedroom with "attic rooms" (a bedroom, living space, and full bath) when I refinanced. I asked the appraisal company what gives, and he told me that the banks like to see it that way now. In other words, 2 things happened. Loan standards got much tighter and banks want to make sure they are not lending more than the minimum amount the house may be worth, and the law changed in NJ so that banks can't speak directly with appraisers anymore. This was supposed to prevent fraud, but what it really did was cause the banks to set appraising standards and blacklist those appraisers who don't comply. I know these blacklists exist because when I did my refi I had to get a 2nd appraisal because the bank had the first company on a blacklist.
So while you may have a bedroom in the technical sense, if it's on the 3rd floor of your house, the bank may disagree with you.
I can not say with certainty what an appraiser ( hired by the bank to determine the market value for a mortgage) or a tax assessor would consider a bedroom - but as a realtor I can say the following
Rholowczak - I disagree with your appraiser - In fact, based on what you described, I have not yet encountered an appraiser who would not consider your 3rd floor bedroom a real "bedroom". I'd say 1/3 of the 4 bedroom houses in maplewood have th 4th bedroom on the third floor.
Metalart - a bedroom need not have it's own door directly to the rest of the house. We call a "daisy chained" bedroom a captive bedroom - and as long as it has a closet and a window and room for a bed and one other piece of furniture - it's a bedroom. A captive bedroom does not add as much value as a regular bedroom , but it's a bedroom.
The criteria I use to call a bedroom a bedroom are - that it is finished with ceiling, walls and a floor, it is heated, it has room for a bed and at least one other piece of furniture, it has a closet and a window. If your bedroom is in the basement, the building code requires (for fire safety) that it either has a door that takes you directly outside, or a window that is large enough and is accessible for an adult to climb out of.
Most realtors I know would call a room without a closet an office/bedroom or just an office. I believe that would also apply to appraisers and assessors - but I would advise you to call the tax assessor in your town and ask him directly - then let us know what he/she says.
If the tax assessor says it makes a difference, do the room without a closet to save on taxes - then add a closet when you get ready to sell.
Good luck
Rholowczak - I disagree with your appraiser - In fact, based on what you described, I have not yet encountered an appraiser who would not consider your 3rd floor bedroom a real "bedroom". I'd say 1/3 of the 4 bedroom houses in maplewood have th 4th bedroom on the third floor.
Metalart - a bedroom need not have it's own door directly to the rest of the house. We call a "daisy chained" bedroom a captive bedroom - and as long as it has a closet and a window and room for a bed and one other piece of furniture - it's a bedroom. A captive bedroom does not add as much value as a regular bedroom , but it's a bedroom.
The criteria I use to call a bedroom a bedroom are - that it is finished with ceiling, walls and a floor, it is heated, it has room for a bed and at least one other piece of furniture, it has a closet and a window. If your bedroom is in the basement, the building code requires (for fire safety) that it either has a door that takes you directly outside, or a window that is large enough and is accessible for an adult to climb out of.
Most realtors I know would call a room without a closet an office/bedroom or just an office. I believe that would also apply to appraisers and assessors - but I would advise you to call the tax assessor in your town and ask him directly - then let us know what he/she says.
If the tax assessor says it makes a difference, do the room without a closet to save on taxes - then add a closet when you get ready to sell.
Good luck
Rholowczak, we had the same experience! When we bought our house, it was listed as a 4 bedroom house with one bedroom in an walk out basement, with windows, proper exit, staircase to the main floor and a closet. When we recently financed, we were told by the appraiser that the basement is a finished basement and the 4th bedroom is not a bedroom but a part of the finished basement. So, for appraisal purpose, our house was considered a 3 bedroom house.
they market maplewood houses all the time as 4 BRs that are really 3 BRs with a refinished attic. They're not really 4 BRs, they're 3 BRs with an attic you can sleep in. I can sleep in the sun room too, doesn't make it a BR.
"Big enough for a bed" is subjective. State regulations are 70 sq feet for a one person bedroom, 100sq feet for a 2 person bedroom. Though I really doubt they'll do a raid on your home and pull you out in handcuffs if they find a husband and wife sleeping in a bedroom less than 100sq feet. I think these numbers are mostly used to keep people from renting to too many people in smaller apartments.
For the most part towns don't specify a size, so the state numbers are enforced. But I remember there was some stink because New Brunswick apparently made it even more restrictive, 100sq feet for a one person bedroom, anything smaller could not be used as a bedroom. The complaint was that they were trying to force lower income people out of town.
For the most part towns don't specify a size, so the state numbers are enforced. But I remember there was some stink because New Brunswick apparently made it even more restrictive, 100sq feet for a one person bedroom, anything smaller could not be used as a bedroom. The complaint was that they were trying to force lower income people out of town.
Jerry_Lundegaard said:
they market maplewood houses all the time as 4 BRs that are really 3 BRs with a refinished attic. They're not really 4 BRs, they're 3 BRs with an attic you can sleep in. I can sleep in the sun room too, doesn't make it a BR.
But many of the attics are converted to a bedroom, windows, closet etc. One of the rooms in our house in PA is very small. You couldn't fit more than a twin bed and a dresser in there.
Our "main" bedroom is 8' by 10'. We used to have a queen sized bed, but it literally took up a little more than half of the bedroom. We downsized to a full sized bed and can now (barely) fit a dresser in there too. Don't tell the authorities!!! ;-)Scarlet said:
One of the rooms in our house in PA is very small. You couldn't fit more than a twin bed and a dresser in there.
You can not reply as this discussion is Closed!
Featured Events
-
Stephen Whitty Presents - Hometown Movie Stars: The Celebrated Actors Of CHS
May 6, 2024 at 7:00pm
My husband and I disagree (I could have sworn that a closet was necessary, but he says no), but as we are doing a reno right now, it would be useful to know definitively before we do the framing. Anyone know the answer?