Is religion finally dying?
Smaller does not equal death, nor does America equal the world.
Interesting. I wish, however, that they had asked how many people consider themselves "spiritual," because in recent years I have noticed a growing trend among people who identify themselves as "spiritual" but no longer affiliate with any religious group.
It's also intriguing to note that the number of evangelical Christians has remained almost steady, while numbers of self-identifying Catholics and Protestants have plummeted. That is actually a little disheartening.
Check back in 50 years when the Millennials are contemplating their mortality.
This doesn't account for enough nuances of the types of people who leave particular religious groups. Many of those who leave were never especially serious about it in the first place; and even if the number of converts does not amount to a full replacement, those who do convert often make greater effort to understand the confession that they have espoused. This could mean that rather than "death," which has been tossed about ad nauseum, there would be a smaller but more knowledgeable and committed church that does so not because it is culturally expected but because its members have made conscious individual commitments.
LOST said:
Check back in 50 years when the Millennials are contemplating their mortality.
Will believing in god make them immortal? ;-)
This actually is not the case, according to the Times story (which is worth actually reading!):
There are few signs that the decline in Christian America will slow. Although some might assume that young people will become more religious as they age, the Pew data gives reason to think otherwise.
“It’s not that they start unaffiliated and become religious,” Mr. Cooperman said. “In fact, it’s the opposite.”
At the same time, every new cohort has been less affiliated than the last, with even the youngest millennials proving less affiliated, at 36 percent, than older millennials, at 34 percent.
LOST said:
Check back in 50 years when the Millennials are contemplating their mortality.
imonlysleeping said:
At the same time, every new cohort has been less affiliated than the last, with even the youngest millennials proving less affiliated, at 36 percent, than older millennials, at 34 percent.
I can't imagine that 2% is not within the margin of error, particularly when discussing subgroups. I would bet good money 36% and 34% are essentially the same, statistically.
Sadly, religion is one of the most divisive forces on the planet. Far too many people believe that THEIR religion is THE one, and everyone else is wrong (or worse). Just imagine what the world could be like if everyone believed in the same religion (or in no religion at all, for that matter). Just imagine if everyone in the Middle East believed in the same religion. (Then they could concentrate on fighting for land and water, I suppose.)
Even within the same religion there is conflict.
To me, the issue is less about whether there are multiple religions, and more about people's desire to impose their religious beliefs on others. Which means it's actually less about religion and more about control. Though some have argued that organized religion is all about controlling people...
And here is another quote from one of my all time favorite people -
author said:
No calculators or charts necessary........I Believe.
Yes author, I believe as well. For me it is such a pleasant way to live, outside of the box. I faithfully can let go at times and have the sheer pleasure of the trees, the birds and the stars and know I am not alone. My grandson recently came to me and said grandma, I don't know what to do. I told him to relax. It will come to him. He has a hope now. It came to him. No calculators, no charts....one human to another... Let go and live. No more scary talk about guns. Let life happen and we are promised, once we keep our word, don't take things personally, don't assume and do our best - okay, now I am quoting the 4 agreements - yet they are so aligned with my catholic upbringing I see no difference. I feel the same with every other religion I have been exposed to. My experience is that religion isn't dying, it is just broadening outside of cultural defines.
ParticleMan said:
Even within the same religion there is conflict.
Particleman, you don't have to agree with them. I do accept them.
To me, the issue is less about whether there are multiple religions, and more about people's desire to impose their religious beliefs on others. Which means it's actually less about religion and more about control. Though some have argued that organized religion is all about controlling people...
oneofthegirls said:
ParticleMan said:
Even within the same religion there is conflict.
Particleman, you don't have to agree with them. I do accept them.
To me, the issue is less about whether there are multiple religions, and more about people's desire to impose their religious beliefs on others. Which means it's actually less about religion and more about control. Though some have argued that organized religion is all about controlling people...
OOTG, I'm sorry, I guess I wasn't clear. By conflict, I didn't mean conflicting opinions. I meant actual conflict - fighting, war, killing.
It all goes back to imposing ones views on others.
One of the most interesting things in that article is the speculation that young people might be abandoning religion because it's increasingly associated with repellent right-wing lunatics. Would be ironic if conservative christians' efforts to impose their lifestyle actually reduced religiosity in a significant way.
Thanks particleman. My experience is not political. I have no clue how to stop that nonsense. To my way of thinking you are correct, control is the goal. It has nothing to do with religious belief.
imonlysleeping said:
One of the most interesting things in that article is the speculation that young people might be abandoning religion because it's increasingly associated with repellent right-wing lunatics. Would be ironic if conservative christians' efforts to impose their lifestyle actually reduced religiosity in a significant way.
As it should!
imonlysleeping said:
One of the most interesting things in that article is the speculation that young people might be abandoning religion because it's increasingly associated with repellent right-wing lunatics. Would be ironic if conservative christians' efforts to impose their lifestyle actually reduced religiosity in a significant way.
I would tend to agree. The article tends to use religion, Catholic/Protestant and Christian interchangeably. I for one, would hesitate to refer to myself as Christian for fear of being mistaken for a Born-again Christian (they seem to have co-opted the term Christian to apply to themselves alone), or worse still a Tea party type. I also agree with PeggyC that they should have made a distinction between Spiritual and the institutional type of religious. I confess I am a bit surprised at the Pew Foundation. They do research all the time, but is seems that they did not have enough of an understanding of the complexity of this subject.
What does it mean to be "spiritual" but not religious? That you believe in spirits? I've never understood what people mean when they say this.
I do attend a darling church out in Mattituck where my sister and brother inlaw serve (deacon) and feel the love from all of the members. We read from the bible and I am open minded enough to understand they believe every word. I accept it. It doesn't mean I have to. There are parts I may not agree with. What is nice is I can express it yet I will never take away that their belief is that way. They invite me to attend and I get much joy from the service. I receive so much love during the day. These are very loving people. There is so much I agree with them.
imonlysleeping said:
What does it mean to be "spiritual" but not religious? That you believe in spirits? I've never understood what people mean when they say this.
To me it means to have taken your formal training of religion, what it means to YOUR spirit,and applied it to your own spirit. I was raised catholic yet I don't necessarily choose to participate in the church. Therefore, not necessarily religious.
Even if you believe in a religion you've created yourself, it's still a religion. If you think there is some superhuman power that's pulling the strings, you are religious.
This probably belongs in Politics but how interesting that certain Right-Wing Republicans who always seem to be mixing Religion with Politics are upset with the Pope for getting involved with Politics.
I disagree. There is no one else in my church and I have no intention of drawing them in. I certainly will share my spiritually yet they do so on their own. Nope. No religion here to join up. THAT is the difference between religion and spirituality.
When they say "religion," they are talking about organized religion, not general belief in a god or gods.
http://www.pewforum.org/2015/05/12/americas-changing-religious-landscape/pr_15-05-12_rls-00/
LOST says: "This probably belongs in Politics but how interesting that certain Right-Wing Republicans who always seem to be mixing Religion with Politics are upset with the Pope for getting involved with Politics."
Interesting and oddly satisfying. heh heh heh. And on the other side, who ever expected to hear Raul Castro describe himself as at least sort of Jesuit.
imonlysleeping says: "Even if you believe in a religion you've created yourself, it's still a religion. If you think there is some superhuman power that's pulling the strings, you are religious."
My thought would be that a spiritual person believes what they believe (which may or may not align with an organized religion), while a religious person may feel entitled to classify what other people believe or should believe.
I completely disagree with your definition of religious. But I'm ok with you believing that.
You can have a religion of one or a religion of 1 billion, but if you explain the mysteries of the universe via belief in a supreme being or beings, that is a religion. It doesn't have anything to do with how many adherents the religion has.
: the belief in a god or in a group of gods
: an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods
: an interest, a belief, or an activity that is very important to a person or group
oneofthegirls said:
I disagree. There is no one else in my church and I have no intention of drawing them in. I certainly will share my spiritually yet they do so on their own. Nope. No religion here to join up. THAT is the difference between religion and spirituality.
Thought this New York Times story was pretty interesting. Millennials (and other age groups) are moving away from religion in significant numbers, and the number of people with no religion at all is on the rise. Both very positive developments, IMO.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/12/upshot/big-drop-in-share-of-americans-calling-themselves-christian.html?_r=0